Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Linda Birnbaum on March 8, 2010 at 10:28am

An H tank will last a long time if you are using a low flow and only using it at night. So if you are using it a flow of 4 liters per minute and the tank is full, the H tank will last you 28 hours if ran continuously. You should also look into a liquid oxygen tank called Helios. Good luck with everything.

Carol Hansen-Dix said:

Again, I have pretty much exausted my possiblities with this electric company but I am moving and, hopefully, the new one will have more programs for people in my position. The extension cord suggestion was very funny and my neighbors are probably not in any better position to pay than I am.
Do you know how many hours one big H tank will hold? Is that the biggest tank? I can research a little and see if the tanks are exchangeable with the concentrator. I am not sure whether I own the concentrator or not yet. It seems like I have been paying long enougth to have paid for it completely but I bet they are pretty expensive.
I appreciate your help, Mary. Thanks, Carol

Mary Z said:

Some power companies give discounts for off peak hours. Night time should qualify. Maybe your power company has such a program. Barring that, an extention cord to a neighbors outside outlet buried in the ground in PVC pipe might not be noticed . Hope something comes along that works for you. The big H tanks may be an affordable alternative. Also if it takes you awhile to go to sleep you could use a timer and set it nightly to give you that extra 15 or 20 minutes with the concentrator off.
Good Luck,
Mary Z.

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Permalink Reply by Carol Hansen-Dix on March 8, 2010 at 11:43am

I have never heard of Helios before. I will definately look into it as an alternative. I really appreciate you responding to my questions. That was very considerate. Thanks for the help from you and from all the great people responding on this site. Very Sincerely, Carol

Linda Birnbaum said:

An H tank will last a long time if you are using a low flow and only using it at night. So if you are using it a flow of 4 liters per minute and the tank is full, the H tank will last you 28 hours if ran continuously. You should also look into a liquid oxygen tank called Helios. Good luck with everything.

Carol Hansen-Dix said:

Again, I have pretty much exausted my possiblities with this electric company but I am moving and, hopefully, the new one will have more programs for people in my position. The extension cord suggestion was very funny and my neighbors are probably not in any better position to pay than I am.
Do you know how many hours one big H tank will hold? Is that the biggest tank? I can research a little and see if the tanks are exchangeable with the concentrator. I am not sure whether I own the concentrator or not yet. It seems like I have been paying long enougth to have paid for it completely but I bet they are pretty expensive.
I appreciate your help, Mary. Thanks, Carol

Mary Z said:

Some power companies give discounts for off peak hours. Night time should qualify. Maybe your power company has such a program. Barring that, an extention cord to a neighbors outside outlet buried in the ground in PVC pipe might not be noticed . Hope something comes along that works for you. The big H tanks may be an affordable alternative. Also if it takes you awhile to go to sleep you could use a timer and set it nightly to give you that extra 15 or 20 minutes with the concentrator off.
Good Luck,
Mary Z.

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Permalink Reply by Mary Z on March 8, 2010 at 12:26pm

Carol, the H tanks are the really big ones, they are heavy enough to require a handtruck. I don't know if the 02 company supplies one.

Mary Z.

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Permalink Reply by Judy on March 8, 2010 at 1:09pm

Talk to your DME provider about switching to a newer more energey efficient 02 concentrator.

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Permalink Reply by Judy on March 8, 2010 at 1:12pm

I could be wrong but I was pretty sure that bleeding 02 supplementation into CPAP therapy requires a continuous flow concentrator.

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Permalink Reply by Henning on March 8, 2010 at 2:11pm

Liquid oxygen.

I don't know the rules in the U.S. but here in Denmark the electricity bill is paid by the public.

But perhaps there is another option, which is also used here.

By continuing need and if you need a mobile device, you can get a large tank (25,000 liters of pure oxygen)

From here you can tap into a mobile oxygen bottle that contains enough oxygen for approximately 9 hours of usage.

This solution requires no power, but of course a regular replacement of the main tank.

Henning

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Permalink Reply by Carl on March 8, 2010 at 5:34pm

There may be another way to skin the cat - so to speak. Try submitting the electric bill to the insurance company and tell them how much the O2 concentrator is using. Se if they'll pick up the tab for it.l If they don't, then maybe they WILL pay for liquid O2. Then, instead of using a concentrator, you'll just get a tank of liquid O2 and breathe from that. They will, of course, have to replace the tank every so often, but it will then be paid for by your insurance company.

Carol Hansen-Dix said:

Thank you SleepyCarol for responding. I spent significant time with my electric company personnel talking about the programs they have to offer and, unfortunately, none were a match for me. I do have my location in my profile and it is Grass Valley, CA. I don't think contacting them again would be beneficial for me at this time. I am moving soon to a different county so maybe they have different programs. I will check that out for sure. Carol

sleepycarol said:

It might help to let us know your location. I don't use oxygen so don't have any personal knowledge.

I know some have talked about different programs, etc. but it depends upon your region. I know where I live our electric company only offers help to those that are unable to leave their homes as far as power outages, etc. If you are mobile then you don't qualify for priority when restoring power. Other electric companies are far more lenient and some even offer discounts for medical devices, which cpap qualifies.

I know you have said you don't qualify for assistance but there maybe someone that can offer suggestions to help you out.

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Permalink Reply by Carol Hansen-Dix on March 8, 2010 at 9:49pm

To: Linda, Mary Z, Judy, Henning, Carl and all the other wonderful people who have responded to my question.
I must say that I am just blown away by the true caring and thoughtfulness of all of you. I want to thank you all very much from the bottom of my heart.

I have looked into liquid O2 and that seems like a real possibility. They supply you with a reservoir tank (filled once a month) and a portable tank that you fill from the reservoir as needed.They have reservoir tanks from 10 liters to 46 liters. The 10 liter can actually go in the car with you but the 46 liter weighs 170 lbs. so it stays at home. The 10L gives you up to 68 hours on a setting of 2.0 lpm. The 46 gives you 432 hours @ 2.0 lpm. They have two sizes of the portable tank the largest holding 20 hours @ 2.0 lpm. I believe that since I have been on O2 already Medicare will let me switch to liquid O2 so I can travel with it. Wow! what a deal...I can have O2 while I am camping even though I can't have my Bi-pap. The liquid O2 doesn't need electricity at all (or batteries). I think all I need is a prescription from my doctor but first I want to find a distributor in my area....had to leave someting for tomorrow.

BTW do any of you with C-pap or Bi-pap ever go camping and if so, how do you do it? Do you just not use your equipment for however many days you're out there?

Again, thank you all so much for your incredible response....you're great! It really makes me think that if we all stick together and help each other there is absolutely nothing we can't deal with.



Carl said:

There may be another way to skin the cat - so to speak. Try submitting the electric bill to the insurance company and tell them how much the O2 concentrator is using. Se if they'll pick up the tab for it.l If they don't, then maybe they WILL pay for liquid O2. Then, instead of using a concentrator, you'll just get a tank of liquid O2 and breathe from that. They will, of course, have to replace the tank every so often, but it will then be paid for by your insurance company.

Carol Hansen-Dix said:

Thank you SleepyCarol for responding. I spent significant time with my electric company personnel talking about the programs they have to offer and, unfortunately, none were a match for me. I do have my location in my profile and it is Grass Valley, CA. I don't think contacting them again would be beneficial for me at this time. I am moving soon to a different county so maybe they have different programs. I will check that out for sure. Carol

sleepycarol said:

It might help to let us know your location. I don't use oxygen so don't have any personal knowledge.

I know some have talked about different programs, etc. but it depends upon your region. I know where I live our electric company only offers help to those that are unable to leave their homes as far as power outages, etc. If you are mobile then you don't qualify for priority when restoring power. Other electric companies are far more lenient and some even offer discounts for medical devices, which cpap qualifies.

I know you have said you don't qualify for assistance but there maybe someone that can offer suggestions to help you out.

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Permalink Reply by Judy on March 8, 2010 at 10:23pm

Forgive my ignorance here but have you verified w/a DME provider that the liquid 02 tanks can be used w/an xPAP??

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Permalink Reply by Carol Hansen-Dix on March 8, 2010 at 10:34pm

Judy,
I am working on that as well. I think so because you can set the liquid O2 on continuous flow but I am talking to their tech support person about that again tomorrow.
Thank you for bringing that up, it could have easily been missed and it is a very important point. It was far from being ignorant, contraire, it was right on!



Judy said:

Forgive my ignorance here but have you verified w/a DME provider that the liquid 02 tanks can be used w/an xPAP??

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Permalink Reply by Carl on March 9, 2010 at 12:50pm

My mother-in-law is using Helios (the liquid O2) 100% of the time - awake or asleep. She has two LARGE tanks. When one runs low, she switches to the other one and at some point they replace the empty one. She also has portable units that are filled from the large tank that she can carry with her. These last several hours (she always tanks some of the small O2 cylinders with her if she might be away too long) - we genearlly leave these in the car.

She was on 6 lpm, but recently got a new "reservoir" type unit (it has to be replaced periodically, but that's covered by her Medicare), she can turn down her flow to half of what it was - so she's running on 3 lpm now. You should look into that as well. Effectively, what that unit does is to cut down on the waste - you are able to breathe the O2 that is in the reservoir easily, and it refills during the non-inhalation phase - after all - continuous flow wastes a LOT of energy by generating excess O2 that is not inspired - it just floats off into the atmosphere. For more information, check out the following link.

http://ccn.aacnjournals.org/cgi/content/full/22/4/41

Carl

Carol Hansen-Dix said:

Judy,
I am working on that as well. I think so because you can set the liquid O2 on continuous flow but I am talking to their tech support person about that again tomorrow.
Thank you for bringing that up, it could have easily been missed and it is a very important point. It was far from being ignorant, contraire, it was right on!



Judy said:

Forgive my ignorance here but have you verified w/a DME provider that the liquid 02 tanks can be used w/an xPAP??

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Carol Hansen-Dix on March 9, 2010 at 7:37pm

Carl,
I know that there is a setting that you can operate the Helios on that only gives you O2 when you inhale and stops when you exhale but I thought that in order to use it with my Bi-pap it would have to be in the "continuous flow" mode. I don't know enough about that right now so I am not sure that is true.
Is your mother-in-law using a C-pap or Bi-pap with her O2?
If so, can her Bi-pap operate properly with the Helios in the "exhale cut-off " mode?

Thanks for responding Carl, I appreciate it, Carol

Carl said:

My mother-in-law is using Helios (the liquid O2) 100% of the time - awake or asleep. She has two LARGE tanks. When one runs low, she switches to the other one and at some point they replace the empty one. She also has portable units that are filled from the large tank that she can carry with her. These last several hours (she always tanks some of the small O2 cylinders with her if she might be away too long) - we genearlly leave these in the car.

She was on 6 lpm, but recently got a new "reservoir" type unit (it has to be replaced periodically, but that's covered by her Medicare), she can turn down her flow to half of what it was - so she's running on 3 lpm now. You should look into that as well. Effectively, what that unit does is to cut down on the waste - you are able to breathe the O2 that is in the reservoir easily, and it refills during the non-inhalation phase - after all - continuous flow wastes a LOT of energy by generating excess O2 that is not inspired - it just floats off into the atmosphere. For more information, check out the following link.

http://ccn.aacnjournals.org/cgi/content/full/22/4/41

Carl

Carol Hansen-Dix said:

Judy,
I am working on that as well. I think so because you can set the liquid O2 on continuous flow but I am talking to their tech support person about that again tomorrow.
Thank you for bringing that up, it could have easily been missed and it is a very important point. It was far from being ignorant, contraire, it was right on!



Judy said:

Forgive my ignorance here but have you verified w/a DME provider that the liquid 02 tanks can be used w/an xPAP??

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