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Problems with sinus pain with CPAP
I'm a fairly new user to the CPAP. I've been using the Resmed S-9 auto adjust CPAP machine for about 2 weeks now. The pressure is set to go as high as 16 at night. I've gone through three masks. I tend to have a hard time breathing through my nose so the first mask was a full face mask. The issue with that was leakage and I could never get it to fit right. I switched to a nasal mask with the same problem...too much leakage and poor fit. There is a humidifier on my machine which miraculously opened my nasal airways to allow me to breathe through my nose through the night. I was so happy about this because I've been a mouth breather at least 75% of the time for years. The mask I'm using now is the swift LT with nasal pillows. I LOVE the fit! It fits perfectly with no air leaks.
Now the downside. Since using the pillows, I have started waking up daily with sinus pain in my forehead and below my eyes at the top of my cheekbones. I've also started experiencing sore throat, along with congestion, runny (actually goopy) nose. This morning I had a sneezing fit after waking up. The headache is awful and causes pressure in my eyes. At first I thought I was coming down with a cold but then I realized that it's not getting any better and it doesn't seem to be getting worse. So my only conclusion can be it's the CPAP or mask causing this.
Could it be the directness of air coming through those little pillows (more direct or forcefull?). Could it be my humidifier is too high or low? I'm not sure if I should adjust it higher or lower! I've tried it between 80 and 86. I try not to go too low because cold air bothers my nose and throat. I just don't know what to do! I feel miserable. I took an ibuprofen yesterday morning because my head hurt so bad... but it really didn't do much to take away the pain. So now I'm sitting here trying to ignore the pain.
Any suggestions? I'm desperate for the cpap therapy to work for me. I was thinking finally I will get a good night's sleep instead of dragging through my days. Finally I will feel good and have energy. Instead I'm stuck with pain and congestion and sore throat.
Thanks!
Views: 13154
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Joanne Smith on
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I'm also fairly new to CPAP use and I'm using the nasal only mask. When i first started using the CPAP I got a sinus infection immediately. I decided to increase the level of humidity from 3 to 5. I also put one drop of Young Living Eucalyptus Radiata in the water reservoir which keeps my sinuses open all night long. In addition i put Ponaris in my nasal passages before going to bed. You can get it at any drugstore. It is some sort of oily drops that were formulated for use by astronauts to avoid drying nasal passages. As far as cleaning my hose and facemask I use Young Living Thieves oil or Purification oil as both are anti-bacterial, anti-viral and anti-fungal. This seems to have helped. The one night I did not use the Eucalyptus Radiata in the humidifier, I woke up in the middle of the night with the worse headache ever! Hope you find something that helps~
Joanne
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Permalink Reply by Shoshana on
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I am able to remain much more compliant with the nasal pillows, in that I don't rip them off in my sleep like I do with other nasal masks. It's a conundrum for me. But I may very well have to find a middle ground with the masks if I can't get past the respiratory issues (ear aches/allergies/infections). These have been fairly continuous since I first donned the nasal pillows. Funny, I did use the nasal pillows for awhile in the beginning of my therapy over a year ago, and didn't experience any of these problems then. Wonder what the difference is between then and now.
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I visited that website. This sounds like a great option, but does not appear to be available as of yet.
Jan vanNiekerk t SnoringElephant said:
I know what you are talking about. I had the same problem.
The cold air "pumping" through your airways causes it to get swollen. This is a natural reaction to the cold dry air.
I am on CPAP treatment since 1997. I must say the first few years I sufferred a LOT. during the time I was in for two sinus operations.
I am quoting from the following web site http://www.fphcare.com/osa/clinical-and-applications/heated-humidif...
"Our lungs function best by receiving air that is 37 degrees and 100% saturated with water. Because the air that we breathe is not at this temperature or humidity it needs to be warmed and moistened before making it to the lungs. This is the role of the nasal airways.
When using CPAP the ability of the nasal airways to add this warmth and moisture can be overwhelmed. The body attempts to heat the air more by directing more blood to the blood vessels in the nasal area in order to transfer heat. This causes an increase in the nasal resistance or more recognizably nasal congestion. With a congested nose breathing on CPAP is much more difficult and uncomfortable.
To prevent this nasal congestion you can use a heated humidifier with your CPAP treatment. The heated humidifier is a chamber filled with water that sits on a heater-plate. The air from the CPAP passes over the warm water in the chamber before it is delivered to your airways. The nasal airways are no longer overwhelmed and nasal congestion is prevented."Unfortunately this is not the ultimate...
What I did was to combine my old (1997) machine with a heated humidification chamber. This assisted, but even during winter times I used to struggle, because the air cools down by the time it reaches my airways.
A friend of mine had the same problem, and he devised his own gadget to keep the tube heated. (He is using a light bulb in a box, with his tube running through it to heat the air) It works, but I think it is dangereous. I will not recommend it!
I am trying to make a point and I am not trying to convince that Fisher and Paykel is the only manufacturer giving this solution.
I then discovered the heated tubing http://www.fphcare.com/osa/clinical-and-applications/thermosmart.html.
"with its unique heated breathing tube, mimics the ability of the nose to heat and humidify the air. Patients will experience new levels of sleep comfort as humidity levels remain constant through the night, regardless of ambient temperature"
This actually keeps the air warm, while the heated humidification (water) moistions the airway.
This is my solution to the problem. I still suffers from allergies, I manage to sleep through the night, even when I suffer from a cold.
I know that some other manufactures do have the same concept.
I am in the process of comparing the different manufacturers. It will be available in a few weeks on my own website.
The combination of these two are the ultimate!
I switched over to the Fisher and Paykel 608 series initially, and are now on their Auto Icon.
Kind regards
Jan the SnoringElephant
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Your Primary appears to be an IGNORANUS ! Dont make me shake my finger at this computer! You did not just fall off the turnip truck you know you do not go to a proctologist for a tooth ache! and you go to a sleep doc for SLEEP!!!!!!! NOT an a unquallified IGNORANUS !
Mike C (at the Beach!) said:Oh THAT Doctor????
Well my primary care doctor says I don't NEED that doctor.....Is there a REAL doctor in the house!!!! :-) I swear, I am in so much pain I really can't take it anymore. I am looking at having my right eardrum punctured to drain fluid. That is about the most painful experience I ever had in my life. And 4 times shot & wounded (USMC Combat), I KNOW Pain......
chris h said:Mike....Mike....What happened to the SLEEP Doctor you found downtown that had all the nice credentials???
Mike C (at the Beach!) said:I don't know where to jump in here...Just home from my family doctor. In 2 months of APAP I have had what I assumed was 2 sinus infections. STILL don't know since my doctor just doesn't "communicate" though I demand it. The 1st time I flushed my sinuses with Neilmed (I think it is called?). A saline solution, gross but got back on my machine after only stopping 1 night. Seemed to just go away in 2 days?
Now with my new little nasal FX mask (I sidelined my Quattro full face) I began to (I HOPE coincidentally!) get the headaches, right ear ache etc again after 3 days. Today woke up with my left ear 100% deaf and my face swelling....Dr prescribed antibiotic ear drops as well as oral pill antibiotics. I am unsure what is going on. Never an ear ache in my 62 years but had sinus surgery about a year ago. I am also beginning to have occasional nose bleeds since beginning APAP 2 months ago. My dumb doctor just responds with "oh, probably just the blood thinner you have to take for your heart"....I want to choke him. I asked today if I need an apnea specific doctor for my APAP complications. NEVER answered! So here I sit at home, deaf with my left face actually swollen with major pain and NO answers. I am looking online for a new doctor since my Medicare choice was just made I have to stay in his same building it seems and ALL of them are idiots in my opinion so not optimistic. Plus, I have an unanswered call into my DME to ask if my new mask requires any setting changes etc. I already accessed the clinic menu & cranked down my minimum to 8, left my max alone at 12 so no idea what comes next. Thought I was beginning to have all the answers and now feel like tossing this APAP?CPAP & just walking away to let nature take it's course. Can't believe how much an earache (and now deafness in that one ear) HURTS! Feel like a big ole 62 year old baby.....
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Hi Joanne,
Oils in the reservoir are not recomended they can breakdown the plastics and cause abcesses in the lungs. Good Sleep,Chris
Joanne Smith said:I'm also fairly new to CPAP use and I'm using the nasal only mask. When i first started using the CPAP I got a sinus infection immediately. I decided to increase the level of humidity from 3 to 5. I also put one drop of Young Living Eucalyptus Radiata in the water reservoir which keeps my sinuses open all night long. In addition i put Ponaris in my nasal passages before going to bed. You can get it at any drugstore. It is some sort of oily drops that were formulated for use by astronauts to avoid drying nasal passages. As far as cleaning my hose and facemask I use Young Living Thieves oil or Purification oil as both are anti-bacterial, anti-viral and anti-fungal. This seems to have helped. The one night I did not use the Eucalyptus Radiata in the humidifier, I woke up in the middle of the night with the worse headache ever! Hope you find something that helps~
Joanne
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Just like when the computer messes up sometimes a reboot will do and sometimes you have to "format" the disk. You can now tell a dud from a diamond .......just stinks getting there. Good Sleep,Chris
Mike C (at the Beach!) said:
I filed to replace my primary care doc today. It will not be effective till May 1.....I now will have to drive 30 miles but going to a doctor who stitched me up once 15 years ago in a bad crash I had racing (open ocean). Hopefully he will steer me to all new doctors. It is a different "plan" altogether. Will have to also change heart doctors, ENT etc, the whole deal will be all new doctors. Hope I live to see it....
chris h said:Your Primary appears to be an IGNORANUS ! Dont make me shake my finger at this computer! You did not just fall off the turnip truck you know you do not go to a proctologist for a tooth ache! and you go to a sleep doc for SLEEP!!!!!!! NOT an a unquallified IGNORANUS !
Mike C (at the Beach!) said:Oh THAT Doctor????
Well my primary care doctor says I don't NEED that doctor.....Is there a REAL doctor in the house!!!! :-) I swear, I am in so much pain I really can't take it anymore. I am looking at having my right eardrum punctured to drain fluid. That is about the most painful experience I ever had in my life. And 4 times shot & wounded (USMC Combat), I KNOW Pain......
chris h said:Mike....Mike....What happened to the SLEEP Doctor you found downtown that had all the nice credentials???
Mike C (at the Beach!) said:I don't know where to jump in here...Just home from my family doctor. In 2 months of APAP I have had what I assumed was 2 sinus infections. STILL don't know since my doctor just doesn't "communicate" though I demand it. The 1st time I flushed my sinuses with Neilmed (I think it is called?). A saline solution, gross but got back on my machine after only stopping 1 night. Seemed to just go away in 2 days?
Now with my new little nasal FX mask (I sidelined my Quattro full face) I began to (I HOPE coincidentally!) get the headaches, right ear ache etc again after 3 days. Today woke up with my left ear 100% deaf and my face swelling....Dr prescribed antibiotic ear drops as well as oral pill antibiotics. I am unsure what is going on. Never an ear ache in my 62 years but had sinus surgery about a year ago. I am also beginning to have occasional nose bleeds since beginning APAP 2 months ago. My dumb doctor just responds with "oh, probably just the blood thinner you have to take for your heart"....I want to choke him. I asked today if I need an apnea specific doctor for my APAP complications. NEVER answered! So here I sit at home, deaf with my left face actually swollen with major pain and NO answers. I am looking online for a new doctor since my Medicare choice was just made I have to stay in his same building it seems and ALL of them are idiots in my opinion so not optimistic. Plus, I have an unanswered call into my DME to ask if my new mask requires any setting changes etc. I already accessed the clinic menu & cranked down my minimum to 8, left my max alone at 12 so no idea what comes next. Thought I was beginning to have all the answers and now feel like tossing this APAP?CPAP & just walking away to let nature take it's course. Can't believe how much an earache (and now deafness in that one ear) HURTS! Feel like a big ole 62 year old baby.....
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have you ever used a neti pot or similar sinus rinse. its recomended twice a day when you are having these allergy synptoms, also, the addition of white fine particle filters with the grey reusable one will help take more allergens out of the air being driven deep into your sinuses. good luck.
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ive started using those bacterial filters, looks like a spinning top, seems to have helped my sinus issues. i was also getting rain out blowing up my nose, that also has stop with the filter use. also one other thing i do that helps my congestion is i put a couple drops of aveda active essential oil drops on my air intake filter it has euchaliptus, camphor, menthol, and perpermint oils in it. only takes 1 or two little drops and does the trick
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Been following this thread and since I have experienced many of the issues discussed, thought I would make or re-enforce some approaches that have worked for me.
Also have bad allergies, had turbinate reduction surgery, 5 yrs. allergy immunotherapy, severe complex sleep apnea (44 arr. per hour) - small jaw is the cause/not weight; oh, and chronic migraines.
Starting on APAP and then CPAP, ended up with repeated sinus infections.
What has worked for me as I now sleep 7-8 hours with 2 arr. per hour...
1. Full face mask (my mouth drops open)
2. humidity (use a CPAP with an attached humidifier); vary the humidity with the room humidity seasonally.
3. minimum room temp of 65 degrees F
4. hypoallergenic filter on CPAP
5. Finally found a dish detergent to wash the mask, tubing, and humidifier that REALLY is fragrance free and color-free (read the fine print on the ingred. list) - I use Green Works dishwashing liquid 'free and clear'. (It's made by the Clorox company, but no bleach.) Shop around, not all the stores carry it.
6. Always use distilled water
7. Prescription nasal spray - Nasonex or similar; every morning and every evening (this will keep the turbinates from re-swelling and needing repeat surgery)
8. Claritin daily
9. with facial pain and/or swelling - treat it immediately as a sinus infection and have your doc prescribe Astelin to open the sinuses up and take an antibiotic; use a Netti pot.
I am pleased to say that I no longer get sinus infections, the CPAP works, and my nose is clearer after a night of humidified, filtered CPAP air.
Hope these suggestions are helpful to others.
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Permalink Reply by John C. Gifford on
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I had the same problems when I started CPAP. You have two issues. One is the fitting, which it appears that you have fixed.
The second is the humidifier. I thought I was sick enough that I went to the doctors and got antibiotics. Through experimenting I found that my heat temperature was too low. So I raised it until I got to where there was water in the tube. I think they call that "Rain out". Than I lowered the temp until just below "rain out". That worked for me. Now I monitor the barometric pressure on the weather forecast. Because as the pressure drops water will evaporate at a lower temp and you will get rain out. So raise and lower the temp setting along with the barometric pressure.
I've loved my CPAP for years now.
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I tried nasal pillows with humidifier and chin strap. I also had severe sinus pain.
I have tried a total face mask. That didn't fit properly, and I have since found out I shouldn't use a total face mask, as I have "dry eye" due to medication.
I had at least a year of success with EasyLife (Respondics) with a chin strap and humidifier, but then my body chemistry must have changed and the chin strap caused my face to break out. I shave my beard off, but that didn't help.
I am trying ResMed's new full face mask Quattro FX. I get about 5 hours of good sleep, and then somehow I am causing the mask to move out of the original position. I then get air leaks.
This mask requires you to place the mask on your nose, swing the mask and tighten the straps. I am still adjusting the straps to see if I am able to fix the problem. I really am hoping I am able to make this mask work for me as I have been searching for the right solution for almost 3 years.
P.S. We also use a room humidifier during the winter, and keep the humidity at about 42-45%.
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Gordon - the Quattro FX probably moves due to not having a headpiece, I have a mask without a headpiece and it's barely usable because of this. For fulll face I'm using an F&P Forma which is very stable but a little heavy.
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