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Latest Activity

Mary Z replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"glad to hear it, Richard.  Keep us posted."
Sunday
Mary Z left a comment for richard graham
"Glad to hear it's working, Richard."
Apr 11
richard graham replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"The chin strap is helping. Been having better sleep. Thanks Ginny and Mary for your help"
Apr 11
Ginny Edmundson replied to Ginny Edmundson's discussion Scheduled for evaluation and possible procedure next day
"Thanks, Mary~  Fingers are crossed.  My pressure is one point lower than when I began (7) and AHI is some lower (7 day average).  I am anxious about sleep study as I have not slept without CPAP in 2.5 years!   "
Apr 6
Mary Z replied to Ginny Edmundson's discussion Scheduled for evaluation and possible procedure next day
"Good job, Ginny Hope the sleep study shows some good results."
Apr 6
Ginny Edmundson replied to Ginny Edmundson's discussion Scheduled for evaluation and possible procedure next day
"Last procedure done!  This time he gave me meds to take before so less anxiety while waiting!  For the first time I was able to eat normal food on the way home after the procedure.  No pain after 12 hours.  If it only works.…"
Apr 5
Mary Z replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"Some folks run their humidifiers in passover mode- not turning on the heat just letting the air blow over the water.  That would not give any heat though. "
Apr 5
richard graham replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"Interesting, I actually feel a little better when I don't use the humidifier, but the humidifier helps with sinuses. The cold air stuff's me up. Gonna try running heat and a nasal spray"
Apr 4
Mary Z replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"Good luck with it- let us know how you do, Richard."
Apr 4
richard graham replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"I just picked up a new chin strap and will use it with my ultra mirage."
Apr 4
richard graham posted a discussion

nasal sprays

Just wanting some suggestions for some good nasal sprays to dry up sinusus. Thank you
Apr 3
richard graham replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"Thanks Mary"
Apr 3
Mary Z replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"I have both.  I use the chin strap with my Wisp and I also have a FFM if I choose to use that one. I'm a mouth breather.  I find nasal masks are easier to fit without leaks"
Apr 3
Mary Z replied to Mary Z's discussion Using comfort features
"Nasacort is now available without a prescription.  I personally use Afrin on the rare nights I need it for being stuffed up."
Apr 3
richard graham replied to Mary Z's discussion Using comfort features
"Mary, do you recommend a good nasal spray?"
Apr 2
richard graham replied to richard graham's discussion mouth breathing
"Wondering if mouth breathers do better with FFM"
Apr 2
richard graham posted a discussion

mouth breathing

I'm a mouth breather, and am wondering weather to get a chin strap or affm
Apr 2
richard graham replied to Mary Z's discussion Using comfort features
"I've been thinking about trying a nasal spray. Thanks that's useful info."
Apr 2
Mary Z replied to Mary Z's discussion Using comfort features
"I have to admit, it's easier to fall asleep."
Mar 31
Ginny Edmundson replied to Mary Z's discussion Using comfort features
"have always used the comfort setting since starting. I tried it once without and hated it. "
Mar 30

I'll preface all this by saying SleepGuide.com is probably the only place on the internet where you can have an intelligent discussion about anything that might cast CPAP in a negative light, given the financial interests of the other venues out there for education and support (read: people who want to sell you CPAP).  But I went to my doctor the other day and we got into a debate about whether if my next sleep study shows that my weight loss has reduced my AHI to acceptable levels, whether I should get off CPAP.   I argued against it, since my perception is that everyone has obstructed breathing at some point when they sleep and that positive airway pressure can only help keep the body oxygenated and healthy, even if the level of obstruction does not rise to the clinically approved definition of an apnea or hypopnea event.  The doctor disagreed, saying that reliance on CPAP reduces muscle tone in the tongue and that it can actually make you worse off.  He likened it to wearing a cast on your foot that keeps the foot immobilized -- sure that is needed at times, but when you don't use those muscles, you lose them.  

What do you all think?

Tags: cpap-weakens-tongue

Views: 1501

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I agree with you. I can't even imagine not using my CPAP at night. I can't sleep soundly at all if I for some reason don't use it, which is not too often. I go into panic mode at just thinking that I may stop breathing; my snoring even before I started using CPAP (around 13 years now) was to the point that my wife could not sleep in the same room, so I know that it has been a life saver.

I don't believe it has weakened my tongue or muscle tone in that area. Yes, I am overweight, but am working on losing, but even before I gained this weight, I relied on the CPAP to breathe, and yes, maybe, peace of mind!

I don't think I will ever discontinue my CPAP, and I don't have a problem with that at all.

Well, here's my non-medical perspective...

I wasn't diagnosed with restless leg syndrome during my study, so I figure my feet, limbs, etc. are mostly immobile when I sleep. So what if my tongue is too?

During the day when I'm awake, I'm exercising my muscles, including my tongue muscles. That should be helping the tone.

I'm not saying there isn't any impact on tongue muscle tone, but it seems to me you also have to balance that against the negatives of the remaining apneas.

Most medical treatments have at least some risk of side effects. However, people generally accept them when/while the benefits exceed the risks.

Mike, Is your doc just flapping his tongue or does he actually have some evidence to back up this statement? Sounds like it is something he made up.

Anecdotally I can say CPAP made my tongue stronger. CPAP gave me renewed vigor and energy to stay awake longer and interact more socially which meant more exercising of my tongue. haha

If I didn't know any better, Id thought that I was listening to General Ripper from the movie Dr. Strangelove. With that said, I've been using cpap for 16 years and my tongue is as strong as it was then. Don't ask me to prove it :-)

uh oh.  need clarification of the reference to Dr. Strangelove.  Not to date you, but I'm 38 years old, and that's a little before my time.

Jeffrey Donaldson said:

If I didn't know any better, Id thought that I was listening to General Ripper from the movie Dr. Strangelove. With that said, I've been using cpap for 16 years and my tongue is as strong as it was then. Don't ask me to prove it :-)



Banyon said:

Mike, Is your doc just flapping his tongue or does he actually have some evidence to back up this statement? Sounds like it is something he made up.

Anecdotally I can say CPAP made my tongue stronger. CPAP gave me renewed vigor and energy to stay awake longer and interact more socially which meant more exercising of my tongue. haha

Flap, flap.  Thanks for the laugh.  After almost 6 years of using a CPAP,  I think my tongue is as strong as ever.  My guess is that when I'm running my mouth, some people would be happier if it was weaker. 



Rette Tyrrel said:

Flap, flap.  Thanks for the laugh.  After almost 6 years of using a CPAP,  I think my tongue is as strong as ever.  My guess is that when I'm running my mouth, some people would be happier if it was weaker. 

Banyon said:

Mike, Is your doc just flapping his tongue or does he actually have some evidence to back up this statement? Sounds like it is something he made up.

Anecdotally I can say CPAP made my tongue stronger. CPAP gave me renewed vigor and energy to stay awake longer and interact more socially which meant more exercising of my tongue. haha

Flap, flap.  Thanks for the laugh.  After almost 6 years of using a CPAP,  I think my tongue is as strong as ever.  My guess is that when I'm running my mouth, some people would be happier if it was weaker. 

A cast is on 24 hr/7 days a week, CPAP is not. Without some evidence, the similarity seems silly.

Well, this article seems to agree with the doc - well, sort of. The news is excellent, BTW!

FWIW, I'm seeing a speech therapist on Monday for the exact mouth, tongue, and throat issues. Can't wait to see what happens then!

I'm afraid to sleep without my CPAP. I've learned of three sleep apnea deaths since my June, 2011 diagnosis.Put me on Mike's side of the line on this.

BUT I would love to learn what your doctor says, Marcia. The article was intriguing. I'm going to start doing the exercises: I'd like to be able to take short naps without "suiting" up and might consider doing so if these exercises were truly effective. Or even just effective.

Marcia Herman said:

Well, this article seems to agree with the doc - well, sort of. The news is excellent, BTW!

FWIW, I'm seeing a speech therapist on Monday for the exact mouth, tongue, and throat issues. Can't wait to see what happens then!

I will attempt to remember to post what happens at the visit! I don't want to sleep w/o my machine either; I hate waking up with 02 levels in the low to mid 80s. Ugh.

And interrmittant hypoxia weakens your cardiovascular system, metabolic system, heart and brain.  Personally, I'd rather risk weakening my tongue than my heart and brain.  Plus a single apnea will kill you if it lasts long enough. 

I'll keep my APAP machine, thanks.  I consider it my best friend and saviour and wouldn't dream of leaving home without it.

Sarah Gorman

P.S. Was that your PCP or sleep doc? ( Scary either way.)

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