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99 replied to 99's discussion colloidal silver
"i have purchased some silver the make my own colloidal silver"
22 hours ago
99 replied to 99's discussion colloidal silver
"just add to the distilled water it is antimicrobial eg cleans your machine and is beneficial for keeping you healthy  from bugs germs viruses you get the picture and when you need to clean the humidifier out, put water on your plants the silver…"
22 hours ago
Mary Z left a comment for richard graham
"If the heated tube works with your machine I would try that.  They also make covers for your tubing which may help some.  I think the heated tube may be your answer.  Keep us posted."
yesterday
Mary Z left a comment for richard graham
"Richard, some folks just use the humidifier in a Passover mode.  They just don't turn it on, but let the air pick up moisture without heat."
yesterday
Mary Z replied to 99's discussion colloidal silver
"99, where have you been?  Do you add the colloidal silver to your humidifier?"
yesterday
Mary Z replied to Andy's discussion Resmed S8 AutoSet II - No Longer Collecting Data??
"I Andy, I realize I'm months behind your post.  I have no idea why your S8 would stoop collecting data.  I'm glad to hear  you're having such improvement with your apnea.  I have made great strides since I changed…"
yesterday
Mary Z replied to Andy's discussion Resmed S10 AirSense - Anyone have one? Any feedback?
"Andy, just found your post.  I don't know anything about this new machine.  How are you liking your new ResMed?"
yesterday
Mary Z left a comment for Kay Day
"Kay, I haven't been around myself and miss the old, active forum."
yesterday
Mary Z left a comment for richard graham
"Hi Richard,  I don't bother with a humidifier.  Someone on the forum suggested not using it and I'm a lot less congested without it.  A good AHI is under 5.  I use the Wisp and have been since it came out.  I think…"
yesterday
hifay replied to Mary Z's discussion Sleep apnea increases risk of osteoporosis
"Always something. Thanks for the information."
yesterday
99 posted a discussion

colloidal silver

a humidifier can be used with colloidal silverthis can keep the humidifier clean for day maybe weeks or longer without the need to clean the humidifiersilver colloidal is antimicrobial and you could just top up your humidifier without cleaning and at the same time treat your bodyor you just put silver on it own into the humidifierSee More
yesterday
richard graham posted a status
"I feel like the humidifier is making me feel yucky and I'm waking up hacking and having to clear my throat a lot for a while."
Nov 3
richard graham posted a discussion

what's a good AHI?

I've been using and auto and it says my AHI HAS been between 4 and 6 and wondering what's a good range.
Nov 2
Andy posted a discussion

Resmed S10 AirSense - Anyone have one? Any feedback?

Hi All,I've just ordered a new Resmed S10 AirSense, and I was wondering if anyone here has used one?Any information or input would be appreciated!See More
Sep 29
Andy replied to Andy's discussion Resmed S8 AutoSet II - No Longer Collecting Data??
"Hi All, Well, I went to the sleep doc today, and he ordered a new S10 for me! I still don't know why my S8 is not tracking data anymore. Anyone have any ideas?"
Sep 29
Oscar Lemus updated their profile
Sep 25
liz4cps commented on liz4cps's group Prince William Co, VA support group
"Just found they have a Facebook for the REMedy event, 1st Class Sleep REMedy Wellness Health Fair."
Sep 25
liz4cps commented on liz4cps's group Prince William Co, VA support group
"Reminder: REMedy event is this Saturday, 10 am to 2pm.  Topics include: Nutrition and Weight Management with Sarah Kelly, Registered Nutritionist/Dietitian Oral Appliance Therapy for Sleep Apnea with Drs. Rena Vakay & Lara…"
Sep 25
Kay Day left a comment for Kay Day
"September 1, 2014 My apologies to Sleep Guide for not participating in a long time. In January 2012 I started classes at the local community college (my husband is an instructor there, and my tuition is refunded when my grades are above a C. My…"
Sep 1
Mary Z posted a discussion

Sleep apnea increases risk of osteoporosis

Sleep apnea/osteoporosis study finds “increased” health riskA recently published study may have found a connection between obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) and osteoporosis, marking yet another health…See More
Aug 23

I'll preface all this by saying SleepGuide.com is probably the only place on the internet where you can have an intelligent discussion about anything that might cast CPAP in a negative light, given the financial interests of the other venues out there for education and support (read: people who want to sell you CPAP).  But I went to my doctor the other day and we got into a debate about whether if my next sleep study shows that my weight loss has reduced my AHI to acceptable levels, whether I should get off CPAP.   I argued against it, since my perception is that everyone has obstructed breathing at some point when they sleep and that positive airway pressure can only help keep the body oxygenated and healthy, even if the level of obstruction does not rise to the clinically approved definition of an apnea or hypopnea event.  The doctor disagreed, saying that reliance on CPAP reduces muscle tone in the tongue and that it can actually make you worse off.  He likened it to wearing a cast on your foot that keeps the foot immobilized -- sure that is needed at times, but when you don't use those muscles, you lose them.  

What do you all think?

Tags: cpap-weakens-tongue

Views: 1616

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I agree with you. I can't even imagine not using my CPAP at night. I can't sleep soundly at all if I for some reason don't use it, which is not too often. I go into panic mode at just thinking that I may stop breathing; my snoring even before I started using CPAP (around 13 years now) was to the point that my wife could not sleep in the same room, so I know that it has been a life saver.

I don't believe it has weakened my tongue or muscle tone in that area. Yes, I am overweight, but am working on losing, but even before I gained this weight, I relied on the CPAP to breathe, and yes, maybe, peace of mind!

I don't think I will ever discontinue my CPAP, and I don't have a problem with that at all.

Well, here's my non-medical perspective...

I wasn't diagnosed with restless leg syndrome during my study, so I figure my feet, limbs, etc. are mostly immobile when I sleep. So what if my tongue is too?

During the day when I'm awake, I'm exercising my muscles, including my tongue muscles. That should be helping the tone.

I'm not saying there isn't any impact on tongue muscle tone, but it seems to me you also have to balance that against the negatives of the remaining apneas.

Most medical treatments have at least some risk of side effects. However, people generally accept them when/while the benefits exceed the risks.

Mike, Is your doc just flapping his tongue or does he actually have some evidence to back up this statement? Sounds like it is something he made up.

Anecdotally I can say CPAP made my tongue stronger. CPAP gave me renewed vigor and energy to stay awake longer and interact more socially which meant more exercising of my tongue. haha

If I didn't know any better, Id thought that I was listening to General Ripper from the movie Dr. Strangelove. With that said, I've been using cpap for 16 years and my tongue is as strong as it was then. Don't ask me to prove it :-)

uh oh.  need clarification of the reference to Dr. Strangelove.  Not to date you, but I'm 38 years old, and that's a little before my time.

Jeffrey Donaldson said:

If I didn't know any better, Id thought that I was listening to General Ripper from the movie Dr. Strangelove. With that said, I've been using cpap for 16 years and my tongue is as strong as it was then. Don't ask me to prove it :-)



Banyon said:

Mike, Is your doc just flapping his tongue or does he actually have some evidence to back up this statement? Sounds like it is something he made up.

Anecdotally I can say CPAP made my tongue stronger. CPAP gave me renewed vigor and energy to stay awake longer and interact more socially which meant more exercising of my tongue. haha

Flap, flap.  Thanks for the laugh.  After almost 6 years of using a CPAP,  I think my tongue is as strong as ever.  My guess is that when I'm running my mouth, some people would be happier if it was weaker. 



Rette Tyrrel said:

Flap, flap.  Thanks for the laugh.  After almost 6 years of using a CPAP,  I think my tongue is as strong as ever.  My guess is that when I'm running my mouth, some people would be happier if it was weaker. 

Banyon said:

Mike, Is your doc just flapping his tongue or does he actually have some evidence to back up this statement? Sounds like it is something he made up.

Anecdotally I can say CPAP made my tongue stronger. CPAP gave me renewed vigor and energy to stay awake longer and interact more socially which meant more exercising of my tongue. haha

Flap, flap.  Thanks for the laugh.  After almost 6 years of using a CPAP,  I think my tongue is as strong as ever.  My guess is that when I'm running my mouth, some people would be happier if it was weaker. 

A cast is on 24 hr/7 days a week, CPAP is not. Without some evidence, the similarity seems silly.

Well, this article seems to agree with the doc - well, sort of. The news is excellent, BTW!

FWIW, I'm seeing a speech therapist on Monday for the exact mouth, tongue, and throat issues. Can't wait to see what happens then!

I'm afraid to sleep without my CPAP. I've learned of three sleep apnea deaths since my June, 2011 diagnosis.Put me on Mike's side of the line on this.

BUT I would love to learn what your doctor says, Marcia. The article was intriguing. I'm going to start doing the exercises: I'd like to be able to take short naps without "suiting" up and might consider doing so if these exercises were truly effective. Or even just effective.

Marcia Herman said:

Well, this article seems to agree with the doc - well, sort of. The news is excellent, BTW!

FWIW, I'm seeing a speech therapist on Monday for the exact mouth, tongue, and throat issues. Can't wait to see what happens then!

I will attempt to remember to post what happens at the visit! I don't want to sleep w/o my machine either; I hate waking up with 02 levels in the low to mid 80s. Ugh.

And interrmittant hypoxia weakens your cardiovascular system, metabolic system, heart and brain.  Personally, I'd rather risk weakening my tongue than my heart and brain.  Plus a single apnea will kill you if it lasts long enough. 

I'll keep my APAP machine, thanks.  I consider it my best friend and saviour and wouldn't dream of leaving home without it.

Sarah Gorman

P.S. Was that your PCP or sleep doc? ( Scary either way.)

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