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Brendan Duffy posted a status
"How did you slhttp://blog.aastweb.org/winners-and-losers-food-for-thought-sleep-and-athletic-success?utm_campaign=subscribers&utm_source=hs_"
Jul 9
Pat Kniel updated their profile
Jul 7
ZolliStar replied to Fred's discussion CPAP - cure worse than the disease
"I'm wondering: what prompted you to consider whether you have sleep apnea in the first place? Also, waking throughout the night isn't uncommon especially as we (*sigh*) age.  I seem to every 90 minutes or so. This pattern probably…"
Jun 27
ZolliStar replied to ZolliStar's discussion New mouth device on the market
"You can try this website:  http://zyppah.com/ I have a MAD (mandibular advancement device). Dr. Steven Park evaluated my mouth and throat (not everyone can use a MAD, it turns out) and pronounced me a candidate for it. The truth?  I…"
Jun 27
Mary Z replied to ZolliStar's discussion New mouth device on the market
"The link didn't work so me so I couldn't see the product.  I do have experience with a supposedly reliable boil and bite device.  I should know by now I have a small mouth and nothing regular size fits.  I don't think…"
Jun 27
richard graham replied to ZolliStar's discussion New mouth device on the market
"If I thought something could work other than this lousy cpap that would be awesome"
May 22
richard graham posted a status
"I moved and have been sick a lot and can't use cpap because of cough and I'm depressed a lot"
Apr 26
Fred posted a discussion

CPAP - cure worse than the disease

It's ironic that before I was diagnosed with sleep apnea in 2000, I had no problem sleeping 8-9 hours a night. If I did wake up during the night, I had no problem falling right back to sleep, and I wasn't tired during the day.From the first night I brought home the CPAP I haven't had one decent night's sleep. Not one. I don't have any problem falling asleep, but I can't stay asleep. At first I was waking up after 4-5 hours and couldn't get back to sleep for a couple of hours. Now it's more like…See More
Apr 13
Fred updated their profile
Apr 13
ZolliStar posted a discussion

New mouth device on the market

I've been hearing advertising for this product over the past few days.  It's sold as something to help snoring, but as I look at the information it seems to me that it would work just as well as my mandibular advancement device (MAD).In other words, this could help some of us with sleep apnea.Read about it here.Anybody have any thoughts about this?  See More
Mar 31
99 replied to Mary Z's discussion AHI finally under five.
"Hi Richard I mainly use an empty humidifier as it reduces noise"
Feb 16
richard graham left a comment for richard graham
"When I can afford it I'd like to get New machine with heated tube"
Feb 10
richard graham replied to Mary Z's discussion AHI finally under five.
"I would like to see this forum active again as well. I will be more aware of what's going on"
Feb 10
ZolliStar posted a discussion

If you have trouble falling asleep....

I thought that when I got my sleep apnea diagnosis, that -- at last! -- all my sleep problems had come to an end.Ha!I have trouble falling asleep. Indeed, I rarely feel sleepy at night although I do feel tired. I even cut back on computer at night, etc., etc. (and installed f.lux on my computer) but I still had trouble. Now I'm doing something different: wearing special glasses (Uvex S1933X Skyper Safety Eyewear glasses). They block out the blue -- and they're making a difference! First I tried…See More
Feb 1
99 replied to 99's discussion colloidal silver
"i have purchased some silver the make my own colloidal silver"
Dec 21, 2014
99 replied to 99's discussion colloidal silver
"just add to the distilled water it is antimicrobial eg cleans your machine and is beneficial for keeping you healthy  from bugs germs viruses you get the picture and when you need to clean the humidifier out, put water on your plants the silver…"
Dec 21, 2014
Mary Z left a comment for richard graham
"If the heated tube works with your machine I would try that.  They also make covers for your tubing which may help some.  I think the heated tube may be your answer.  Keep us posted."
Dec 21, 2014
Mary Z left a comment for richard graham
"Richard, some folks just use the humidifier in a Passover mode.  They just don't turn it on, but let the air pick up moisture without heat."
Dec 21, 2014
Mary Z replied to 99's discussion colloidal silver
"99, where have you been?  Do you add the colloidal silver to your humidifier?"
Dec 21, 2014
Mary Z replied to Andy's discussion Resmed S8 AutoSet II - No Longer Collecting Data??
"I Andy, I realize I'm months behind your post.  I have no idea why your S8 would stoop collecting data.  I'm glad to hear  you're having such improvement with your apnea.  I have made great strides since I changed…"
Dec 21, 2014

Just heard from a sleep tech that her sleep center, located within a  highly prestigious hospital in one of America's largest and most affluent metropolitan centers, fills patients humidifiers with tap water on CPAP titrations.  furthermore, a 7 year-old child contracted Legionnaires Disease and died from being titrated with a CPAP humidifier filled with tap water.

Make sure you insist on distilled or reverse osmosis/ purified bottled water for your CPAP titrations in the sleep center.  The life you save may be your own.

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Replies to This Discussion

There  are so many nested comments about distilled water that I can't follow it. To sum it up, why is there such a long discussion  bout using distilled water? It's 89 cents a gallon and lasts quite a while. Play it safe and use distilled for sleeping with, for washing and for rinsing the tank. I never had a buildup or had to replace the chamber using distilled and a bit of vinegar once a week and baby shampoo and distilled to wash and rinse every day.

to some people it is not important but to others it is very important and all for different reasons 

I guess you're right but I'm just doing what the DME told me to do. It's simple and it works for me.

99 said:

to some people it is not important but to others it is very important and all for different reasons 

I guess this is good to discuss, and always be aware of what is being put into your body, even in a medical climate. But the scare factor is off-putting to me.  I would like to see a news article to back this up, and am dismissing the Legionaires thing until I see it.

With that being said, you can do everything possible to ensure your safety.  Believe it or not, tap water is not the only source of contamination. If you have a leak in your plumbing system or even the the faucet itself is a source of bacteria. I had my well water tested for a home daycare license, and it failed due to contamination. The health department wanted to condemn my well! After a more experienced inspector came out, we broke my faucet down, cleaned it with bleach, put it back together and guess what? Clean bill of health, no contamination. How many people think to unscrew the end of their faucet and clean it?  Well I do now. But I use distilled water in my tank to sleep with every night.

Another thing that I saw being discussed, was using bleach to disinfect your chamber. While this seems ok on a surface level, would you huff bleach?  If you need to clean your chamber of some type of calcification, use a vinegar and water soak, and then decontaminate. Use a 50-50 mix of water and hydrogen peroxide. The peroxide will kill the bacteria but will not leave the harmful fumes of bleach.  I don't have any problem using tap water with the peroxide to clean the chamber, just won't sleep with tap water in the chamber.

I have asthma and very sensitive lungs due to a long childhood inhaling 2nd hand smoke, the peroxide has never bothered me and I have never (knock on wood) had a sinus or bronchial infection (other than a bug caught from my family) since I began using my CPAP. Hope this helps.

Very interesting, Sherry. Thank you.

Sherry Rachauskas said:

I guess this is good to discuss, and always be aware of what is being put into your body, even in a medical climate. But the scare factor is off-putting to me.  I would like to see a news article to back this up, and am dismissing the Legionaires thing until I see it.

With that being said, you can do everything possible to ensure your safety.  Believe it or not, tap water is not the only source of contamination. If you have a leak in your plumbing system or even the the faucet itself is a source of bacteria. I had my well water tested for a home daycare license, and it failed due to contamination. The health department wanted to condemn my well! After a more experienced inspector came out, we broke my faucet down, cleaned it with bleach, put it back together and guess what? Clean bill of health, no contamination. How many people think to unscrew the end of their faucet and clean it?  Well I do now. But I use distilled water in my tank to sleep with every night.

Another thing that I saw being discussed, was using bleach to disinfect your chamber. While this seems ok on a surface level, would you huff bleach?  If you need to clean your chamber of some type of calcification, use a vinegar and water soak, and then decontaminate. Use a 50-50 mix of water and hydrogen peroxide. The peroxide will kill the bacteria but will not leave the harmful fumes of bleach.  I don't have any problem using tap water with the peroxide to clean the chamber, just won't sleep with tap water in the chamber.

I have asthma and very sensitive lungs due to a long childhood inhaling 2nd hand smoke, the peroxide has never bothered me and I have never (knock on wood) had a sinus or bronchial infection (other than a bug caught from my family) since I began using my CPAP. Hope this helps.

sunlight and UV light an act as disinfectant

Exposure to sunlight has been shown to deactivate diarrhea-causing organisms in polluted drinking water. Three effects of solar radiation are believed to contribute to the inactivation of pathogenic organisms:

  • UV-A interferes directly with the metabolism and destroys cell structures of bacteria.
  • UV-A (wavelength 320-400 nm) reacts with oxygen dissolved in the water and produces highly reactive forms of oxygen (oxygen free radicals and hydrogen peroxides) that are believed to also damage pathogens.
  • Cumulative solar energy (including the infrared radiation component) heats the water. If the water temperatures rises above 50°C, the disinfection process is three times faster.

At a water temperature of about 30°C (86°F), a threshold solar irradiance of at least 500 W/m2 (all spectral light) is required for about 5 hours for SODIS to be efficient. This dose contains energy of 555 Wh/m2 in the range of UV-A and violet light, 350 nm-450 nm, corresponding to about 6 hours of mid-latitude (European) midday summer sunshine.

At water temperatures higher than 45°C (113°F), synergistic effects of UV radiation and temperature further enhance the disinfection efficiency

Enrique and others looking for the news story -- i just looked for the news story myself, and didn't turn anything up.  But that means nothing. Especially for those of you who work in the medical field, you know how often physicians and other health care workers make mistakes. . . and how common it is for them to cover them up.  My RN friends tell me cover ups happen all the time.

i think it is twist truth back in1997

where legionaries disease was attributed to a whirl pool

this maybe how they want to explain their version to avoid implicating a CPAP 

OK, here's an official statement on Legionnaire's and water. http://www.state.nj.us/health/cd/legion/documents/legion_icg.pdf 

IOW, use distilled water and regularly sterilize. Yes, it's for a hospital setting but germs are opportunistic in any setting. They do say that immune-compromised people are at higher risk to come down with it.

Sherry:

I told her to dilute the bleach 1 to 5 to kill any bacteria and then wash until the smell goes away. This is what is normally done in hospitals in the USA.

I have asthma for 74 years and have had no problems with this in a dilute form. If you don't like the bleach fumes, you need to stay our of pools as sodium hypochlorite (bleach) is the same chemical used in pools, spas, etc.

Bleach is a 3-6% solution of NaOCl with some sodium hydoxyide to keep it stabilized. A 12% solution is used in municipal water treatment facilities for sterilization in a ratio of 1 to 4000. If you have a well drilled, they will pour down a gallon of household bleach down the well to sterilize the well. You do then let the water run until the smell disappears.

Sodium hypochlorite is one of the most effective disinfectants. Hydrogen peroxide, while definitely not as effective, can be used without dilution as this is nothing but water with an extra oxygen molecule. We used a mixture of hydrogen peroxide and baking soda for years as our tooth paste at the recommendation of our previous dentist to kill the bacteria beneath the gums. This allowed my wife avoid painful gum surgery. I just rather use something stronger at the end of the humidifier season.

Sherry Rachauskas said:

I guess this is good to discuss, and always be aware of what is being put into your body, even in a medical climate. But the scare factor is off-putting to me.  I would like to see a news article to back this up, and am dismissing the Legionaires thing until I see it.

With that being said, you can do everything possible to ensure your safety.  Believe it or not, tap water is not the only source of contamination. If you have a leak in your plumbing system or even the the faucet itself is a source of bacteria. I had my well water tested for a home daycare license, and it failed due to contamination. The health department wanted to condemn my well! After a more experienced inspector came out, we broke my faucet down, cleaned it with bleach, put it back together and guess what? Clean bill of health, no contamination. How many people think to unscrew the end of their faucet and clean it?  Well I do now. But I use distilled water in my tank to sleep with every night.

Another thing that I saw being discussed, was using bleach to disinfect your chamber. While this seems ok on a surface level, would you huff bleach?  If you need to clean your chamber of some type of calcification, use a vinegar and water soak, and then decontaminate. Use a 50-50 mix of water and hydrogen peroxide. The peroxide will kill the bacteria but will not leave the harmful fumes of bleach.  I don't have any problem using tap water with the peroxide to clean the chamber, just won't sleep with tap water in the chamber.

I have asthma and very sensitive lungs due to a long childhood inhaling 2nd hand smoke, the peroxide has never bothered me and I have never (knock on wood) had a sinus or bronchial infection (other than a bug caught from my family) since I began using my CPAP. Hope this helps.

Boiling tap water may kill any bacteria or viruses but it also concentrates any contaminants such as chlorine, rust, lead etc.  Please don't use boiled water. Avoid breathing in those concentrated chemicals forced into your lungs all night.  Distilled water is the best water to use.
Jan

Gordon,

 

Not arguing with your advice, just everyone cannot use bleach w/o some problems. You are right, I cannot go in pools or hot tubs because I cannot tolerate the chlorine. I have a compromised immune system and have the markers for some type of immune disorder that has not fully developed yet and am being watched for development.  In my case, peroxide is the better choice. And yes, I do use mine full strength, but was advised to split 50-50 with water for easier rinsing. It just doesn't bother me like bleach does, so I prefer peroxide.  I think this forum is great for discussing all the options, since everyone has a different experience, what works for one, may help someone else, but will not work for everyone. Use the advice, but always discuss with your doctors if you are unsure.


 
Gordon H said:

Sherry:

I told her to dilute the bleach 1 to 5 to kill any bacteria and then wash until the smell goes away. This is what is normally done in hospitals in the USA.

I have asthma for 74 years and have had no problems with this in a dilute form. If you don't like the bleach fumes, you need to stay our of pools as sodium hypochlorite (bleach) is the same chemical used in pools, spas, etc.

Bleach is a 3-6% solution of NaOCl with some sodium hydoxyide to keep it stabilized. A 12% solution is used in municipal water treatment facilities for sterilization in a ratio of 1 to 4000. If you have a well drilled, they will pour down a gallon of household bleach down the well to sterilize the well. You do then let the water run until the smell disappears.

Sodium hypochlorite is one of the most effective disinfectants. Hydrogen peroxide, while definitely not as effective, can be used without dilution as this is nothing but water with an extra oxygen molecule. We used a mixture of hydrogen peroxide and baking soda for years as our tooth paste at the recommendation of our previous dentist to kill the bacteria beneath the gums. This allowed my wife avoid painful gum surgery. I just rather use something stronger at the end of the humidifier season.

Sherry Rachauskas said:

I guess this is good to discuss, and always be aware of what is being put into your body, even in a medical climate. But the scare factor is off-putting to me.  I would like to see a news article to back this up, and am dismissing the Legionaires thing until I see it.

With that being said, you can do everything possible to ensure your safety.  Believe it or not, tap water is not the only source of contamination. If you have a leak in your plumbing system or even the the faucet itself is a source of bacteria. I had my well water tested for a home daycare license, and it failed due to contamination. The health department wanted to condemn my well! After a more experienced inspector came out, we broke my faucet down, cleaned it with bleach, put it back together and guess what? Clean bill of health, no contamination. How many people think to unscrew the end of their faucet and clean it?  Well I do now. But I use distilled water in my tank to sleep with every night.

Another thing that I saw being discussed, was using bleach to disinfect your chamber. While this seems ok on a surface level, would you huff bleach?  If you need to clean your chamber of some type of calcification, use a vinegar and water soak, and then decontaminate. Use a 50-50 mix of water and hydrogen peroxide. The peroxide will kill the bacteria but will not leave the harmful fumes of bleach.  I don't have any problem using tap water with the peroxide to clean the chamber, just won't sleep with tap water in the chamber.

I have asthma and very sensitive lungs due to a long childhood inhaling 2nd hand smoke, the peroxide has never bothered me and I have never (knock on wood) had a sinus or bronchial infection (other than a bug caught from my family) since I began using my CPAP. Hope this helps.

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